'Secondly - you would be surprised, but warranty claims arent really an indicator or actual reliability[/quote]'

I'm not sure I understand this point, if a car needs work completed under warranty then surely that suggests the vehicle has an issue? Therefore details of the level of warranty claims by model from LR would provide some indication of reliability would it not??

I know from my own experience in the last 18 months that some LR main agents are at times struggling to cope with the number of broken down LR’s that turn up on recovery trucks courtesy of LR assistance, it makes planning their regular scheduled servicing business very challenging.

Also I was told by Enterprise car rental that at certain times last year the LR contract was causing them major issues due to the volume of demand for hire cars to replace broken down LR’s being far greater than the agreement with LR had made provision for. They had to re-negotiate the arrangement to ensure additional vehicles were taken onto their fleet just to cover the LR business.

I’ve heard from LR sales people and service personnel that they do have significant issues with a number of models and I know 4 friends with either FF or RRS’s who have all had major issues in the last 18 months.

Whilst my summary is not a comprehensive assessment of the reliability of these vehicles and the survey might not be 100% accurate, to suggest LR’s do not have a well-deserved reputation for poor reliability would be in my opinion, somewhat hard to defend.

Again, I will state that I love Rangies, there are plenty of good ones out there, but there are also far too many that experience reliability issues for LR to shed its perceived reputation for being close to or at the bottom of reliability surveys such as the Which survey posted by Muddywheels. --------------------------------------------------------
RRS TDV8 Black/Black (Gone)
RRS TDV8 Stornaway (Gone)
RR Vogue TDV8 (Gone)
RRS 4.4V8 (Gone)
Defender 110 300tdi (Stolen, much missed)
RR Vogue V8 P38 (Gone)
LR 90 TD (Gone)

What's interesting, to me at least, is that the D4 (2010-) has significantly better reliability than the RRS (2005-). This suggests to me that LR have improved the quality of their products. 80% is still too low, however, and LR need to get up in to the mid-90s.

I still have the suspicion that reliability would improve if they built the vehicles somewhere other than the UK... 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

As we know forums generate a shaded view, reliability surveys tend to be the same as the people whe respond tend to be the ones with "issues"
Whether it is perceived or actual, these vehicles are problematic and it seem the minority don't have problems when in fact it should be the majority.
As I have preached for many years, a government department might make the manufacturers behave as a business should and not ride rough shod over people who have paid large quantities of money and therefore relative expectation linked to that cost price. If it were a 15000 focus then no you wouldn't expect quite so much. 2x TDV6. SE and HSE. Both returned to sender with issues👀
TDV8 Sport HSE...... Gone. Loved it but it didn't love me!!
Now rolling in MY10 Fullfat TDV8 Vogue. Slammed it to go round corners🙈
Cruising daily #56 mph in a Volvo V8. 😱
Lots of other toys in the cupboard...😜

I agree with nearly every things you say ^^^. However while you might 'expect' better durability from a more expensive car a buyer of a £15k Focus should still be able to expect reliability.

We should have more teeth that really assist consumers get cars that are "fit-for-purpose". The fact that the RRS seems to have an appetite for alternators, turbo-chargers, suspension components etc. and that relatively simple problems require a 'body-off' operation is pretty poor design.

It beggars belief that the one industry that causes problem after problem for consumers but hasn't been regulated or controlled by government. The very lax lemon laws introduced by Major government don't have teeth and the basic thought is people should waste more time and money going through the court system to get redress. All smacks of jobs for the boys and hence very few taking that route. Even with legal insurance, I will still have to cough up several grand to take Guy Slippery Salmon to court in the not too distant..... Know of no other trade or service that can charge for a repair, make a dogs dinner of it and stick two fingers in the air and say no refund even though they were unable to fix the car to reasonable and serviceable level.
Wine time.…  2x TDV6. SE and HSE. Both returned to sender with issues👀
TDV8 Sport HSE...... Gone. Loved it but it didn't love me!!
Now rolling in MY10 Fullfat TDV8 Vogue. Slammed it to go round corners🙈
Cruising daily #56 mph in a Volvo V8. 😱
Lots of other toys in the cupboard...😜

Simple I couldn't agree more about laws needing more teeth. What other product can the manufacturer take back, not supply a replacement, and while holding the product, argue about whether they are obligated to replace or refund. And the replacement when offered is completely different from the original product. Terrible. Pity I can't access that wine certainly could use one!  SWMBO owns this car I get to drive occasionally

Ancedotal I know but roadside assist and I became good friends His comment was that the three brands they are called out to the most, and could not recommend, were - drum roll....Land Rover, Mercedes, and Jeep. His comment was that the new Jeeps in particular were shockers with many bits falling off. For what that is worth  SWMBO owns this car I get to drive occasionally

As the wine came from your country am sure you will be able to find a bottle do enjoy a bottle of Oxford Landing
Much like you, I knew the recovery and rescue drivers by first name  2x TDV6. SE and HSE. Both returned to sender with issues👀
TDV8 Sport HSE...... Gone. Loved it but it didn't love me!!
Now rolling in MY10 Fullfat TDV8 Vogue. Slammed it to go round corners🙈
Cruising daily #56 mph in a Volvo V8. 😱
Lots of other toys in the cupboard...😜

codfather wrote:

IMHO, I am pretty sure a lot of the percieved problems that landrover have ARE because people expect more.
if you are having a sideways move from BMW/Merc etc ,(had so many probelems with gearbox in my ML and the dealers are rubbish) then yes you will be shocked at the agricuturalness of the build quality (rippled panels etc) ,but if you are moving up the way from ford or vauxhall then you will have less "percieved" problems (i think)
at the end of the day, it was built as an off roader (with a very expensive and sophisticated drivetrain) which it does very well.- would it sell as well if it was rubbish off road but had better quality parts for the same price?

cheers
Dave

I moved from ford to Toyota then Lr and had no complaints for 10 years but my move from Lr to RR has been disastrous and on this occasion I have to agree with which

I also found all my LR's better in winter/poor weather than my RRS too - not as refined or quick though  Wanted a Series 2 LR since childhood but previously owned MY16 Disco Sport HSE TD4 Auto, MY13 RR Sport Black Edition TDV6 Auto, MY10 RR Sport HSE TDV6 Auto, 2007 Freelander 1 Freestyle TD4 Soft Top, 2009 Freelander 2 GS TD4 Auto, 2007 Freelander 2 GS TD4, 2004 Disco 2 Metropolis Auto, 2002 Disco 2 GS, 2000 Freelander 1 SE TD4 SW

Still hoping for a S2 one day!