440e for me - have recently had a Jaguar iPace for three years - that drivetrain was fantastic - and currently have a Volvo XC90 T8 with all of 15 electric miles' range - still managing 20% electric mileage even with quite a lot of trips at 200-400 miles in a day with no chance to recharge

Got a 510e on order. Was wavering on changing to a D350 as I think diesels definitely suit big SUVs (I’ve previously run the 4.4 V. But dealer advised a) the hybrids will hold their value better as people are definitely moving away from diesel; and b) if you want rear wheel steer and 48v anti roll bars then you realistically need to get them as standard spec (i.e. 510e or 530) as the Stormer Pack option will unlikely NOT be an option for a long time due to chip availability.

FWIW, I have a 4.0 V8 petrol in my Cayenne which is properly bonkers when you want it to be, but for the other 90% of the time the torquey diesel in my last RRS was as good, if not better.

Oh, and Seen Through Glass on YouTube has a review of the 510e. The V6 petrol looks punchy and sounds nice when you poke it. Current: Cayenne GTS (got fed up with waiting for LR to build my third RRS)
On order: RRS3 510e AB
Gone: RRS SDV8 AB, RRS SDV6, Vauxhall Nova 1.0, Nova 1.3 SR, Nova 1.4 SRi, Renault Laguna (why?), BMW 318is coupe (fabulous - despite having to buy a radio and tape player for it from Halfords), 323i saloon, 325ti compact (superb), 320td compact (awful), VW Golf 2.0d 4Motion (all the car you really need), BMW 120d compact (excellent), 118d compact (slow), 335d coupe (rapid)

Tim oop north wrote:

440e for me - have recently had a Jaguar iPace for three years - that drivetrain was fantastic - and currently have a Volvo XC90 T8 with all of 15 electric miles' range - still managing 20% electric mileage even with quite a lot of trips at 200-400 miles in a day with no chance to recharge

matpop wrote:

Has anyone considered the weight difference between Hybrid and diesel?
In the spec the gap between the motorization is 345Kg (EU).
It means that every time you press on the gas a little harder, the combustion engine kicks in and consumption changes; therefore you must also consider the driving style that is adopted; if you drive mainly in queue there is no doubt.

345 Kg thought you must be joking
So checked out — you are spot on .
345Kg that’s 54 British Stone if I am right .
WOW - That’s like 3 fat asses sitting in the back .
Your comments will be appreciated,

[quote="Blackbird458"]

Blackbird458 wrote:

345 Kg thought you must be joking Rolling with laughter
So checked out — you are spot on .
345Kg that’s 54 British Stone if I am right .
WOW - That’s like 3 fat asses sitting in the back .
Your comments will be appreciated,

Click image to enlarge

I've been running a L405 P400e for 2 1/2yrs and here are some reasons why I dont like it and also reasons why the P440e/510e might be better

1) The petrol engine in the P400e is only a noisy thrashy 4cyl 2litre which IMHO is totally inappropriate for a car like the RR/RRS which really should have a 6 cyl or 8 cyl engine. Obviously the P440e/510e has a 6 cyl engine so thats been fixed

2) The throttle response even in Sport mode is unacceptably slow especially from stationary. When you press the accelerator pedal, there is a delay seemingly whilst the transmission decides whether its going to take off in petrol or electric mode. This often makes pulling into gaps in the traffic at roundabouts or junctions a heart in mouth moment although I have learnt to anticipate it a bit and press the pedal earlier than normal. The jury is out whether the P440e/510e is improved in this area and only a test drive will tell

3) The brake pedal feel is inconsistent because of the regeneration. Sometimes I find myself braking too hard and sometimes not hard enough. Again I hope that is improved on the P440e/510e

4) The L405 is about as far from sporty as you can get but with the extra 300kg+ weight of the batteries and electric motor in the P400e it handles like a galleon in a storm and also the ride is somewhat choppy. I am told that because the batteries in the P440e/510e are under the seats rather than under the boot, the PHEV versions of the new RRS do not handle or ride much differently from the diesel versions but I'll believe that when I drive it. Another advantage of having the batteries under the seats is that apparently there is no loss of boot space as there is with the P400e

5) So what about the improved fuel consumption that PHEVs are supposed to offer? Well here's my experience. The commute to my office from home and back is 23 miles. I have fitted a fast charger at home and at work and I plug in religiously at the end of every commute and the result is, according to the L-R app, I'm getting 100mpg plus for every journey which is great. The problem is when I do long distance business trips which I do about 3 or 4 times a month. The battery runs out of charge after about 30-40 miles so the rest of my journey is powered by the wheezy 2 litre petrol engine and the result of that is that I'm regularly seeing 23-24mpg on long journeys which is disappointing to say the least. Overall and according to the car trip meter, I'm doing about 34mpg which I suppose is slightly better than a diesel L405 would average but IMHO is not worth the disadvantages of the P400e I've described above. The other problem is that the petrol tank capacity is nowhere near the 91 litres advertised. I have never been able to put more than 70 litres in my tank which means I'm lucky to see a range of 300 miles. And the next problem is that with only a 7kw charger, charging en route is impossible unless youve got 2 1/2hrs to waste and youre fortunate enough to find a vacant charger (btw you get some very dirty looks from EV drivers if you are occupying a charger). Having said this, I think the P440e/510e should be better than the P400e in terms of fuel consumption. With a claimed range of 70miles, the EV range should be twice that of the P400e which should have a beneficial effect on consumption for both short and long journeys. Not only that but with a 50kw charger onboard rather than a 7kw charger, fast charging en route becomes much more viable so with a bit of planning it should be possible to retain some battery charge for the whole journey. And in addition to that, I'm told that the P440e/P510e power pack is capable of charging the batteries from the engine (can anyone confirm that?) which the P400e cannot do which means again that battery charge should be retained longer

So which engine did I order for my new RRS? Well my heart said diesel but my head said P440e. Firstly the residual values of the PHEVs should be better which translates into lower contract hire rates and thats been confirmed by my dealer. Secondly, I'm hoping that with the new technology, the P440e should give better fuel consumption than the P400e and thirdly with a 6 cyl engine instead of a 4 cyl one, that removes one of my objections to the P400e. I will try to get a test drive in both the P440e and the D300 before my order goes to build but that may not be possible I guess

As I live now in Switzerland yet need to drive for business and private meetings at least 1000km 2x a month I have had a long and noteworthy discussion on diesel or phev with a family owned LR dealer salesperson in Switzerland. His experience: 2.0PHEV is not a great combination, only works for small commutes. Any serious long distance driving as well trips into the mountains: you will find yourself dragging 2.5tonnes of weight with a too small engine. Moreover, depreciation is high on the 2.0PHEV in RRS and RR in Switzerland because of the in practice high fuel consumption of 10-11ltr/100km (equal to my D3!!!).

So for outgoing RRS verdict is: 300ps D6 or 340V8 diesel if making more than 10.000km per annum, otherwise v6 or v8 petrol… With the new RR and RRS 3.0PHEV (whether 440 or 510) the response was still, go for diesel when making more than 15.000km per annum. Also because the D6 has proven itself as a reliable engine compared to the sdv6.

To make comparison complete. New Defender 110 D6 is not for me, drive it regularly, more of what the D5 should have been, but as 110 too small in boot space, windows too small to let light in like a D3/Defender/FFRR. German Autobahn performance and electronic aids are good and almost at Audi level (have driven both 2012MY A7 and 2016MY Audi Q7 for 3 years so I know what good , built quality, and road perfornance is). But: always upgrade from the base spec Meridian to mid-range as the base spec should not be put in at all.

So for now I continue making the miles with my D3 (have driven a full spec D5 for 3yrs in between but was not impressed / bonded with the car) until the new RRS/RR hybrids are available for test drive. But would not be surprised if I opt for the D6 300 or 350 instead. Also expect to benefit from a less stressed supply chain by then.

Agree with the first bit of that, particularly the fact that the 2.0 litre engine in the P400e package is not appropriate for dragging 2.5t of RR or RRS around when the battery runs out

However I'm not sure I agree about the new P440/510e because as I said previously on this thread, the fact that these have about twice the electric range and, crucially, a much faster onboard charger which should mean that charging on long journeys becomes viable and which should lead to an overall lower fuel consumption on longer journeys. Anyway as you say, it does depend how they drive. If the throttle response, handling and brake feel is as bad as the P400e then I'll be changing my order to one of the diesel engines