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Paddi



Member Since: 06 Jul 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 1563

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Java Black
Aaaarghh - TDV8 exhaust manifold possible issue

Whilst having some other servicing done (ARC bushes and front lower arms) I asked my independent specialist to have another look at the source of a whistle on acceleration that has been there for the last 10k miles or so. Now getting a bit louder. (It's not the upper boost pipes).

Previously the guys thought it was a lower boost pipe leak, which is bad enough since that means body off to fix apparently.

Now they aren't sure but think it might be the known issue that afflicts TDV8s of a warped N/S exhaust manifold allowing exhaust gas to escape at the mating surface of manifold and cylinder head; probably due to a broken stud.

(BTW I had previously suggested this but the possibility was dismissed the first time around). Rolling Eyes

It was also noticed that one of the bolts holding turbo to exhaust is not fully home but it won't move and there's no sooty deposits so may not be leaking.

It looks as if the body is going to have to come off whichever of these possibilities is the problem.

I'm worried that if there is a broken stud, then removing it unless done properly might cause a bigger problem requiring cylinder head removal.

So ..... anyone know the best way to handle it? Any new wizzo techniques?

I've heard of using left handed drill bits to encourage the little b*****d to come out, and similarly using a left handed tap wound into it. I've had some experience before and know that those tapered extractors are useless. Never tried the 'Easy Outs' that Snap-on supply but some say they are good.

Drilling centrally and straight is usually the biggest problem. What's the access to the manifold like once the body is off? Easy or restricted? 2008 MY Java Black TDV8 HSE

Post #510071 Mon Nov 14 2016 6:23pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 12 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 8971

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

Interested in this one. My TDV8 has started to whistle on acceleration and I'm told that the turbo bracket on the NS turbo is missing! I'm wondering if there's a leak like yours. I didn't know that this leaking was a known issue on the TDV8 though (missing bracket notwithstanding).

Censored . Big Cry 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #510096 Mon Nov 14 2016 9:56pm
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Paddi



Member Since: 06 Jul 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 1563

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Java Black

RRSTDV8 - you may well have the same issue. Forum contributor 'Bob.' kindly supplied the text of the relevant TSB in a previous post:

http://www.rrsport.co.uk/forum/post391360.html

Of course it may not be the exhaust manifold leaking but the evidence is strong.

Having just spent some serious money on the transmission fix and the suspension arms etc, it is a bit gutting to be facing another big bill quite so soon but think it has to be done. Perhaps my independent would do us a deal for both vehicles? 2008 MY Java Black TDV8 HSE

Post #510110 Tue Nov 15 2016 4:34pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 12 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 8971

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

Mine has started making a whining/whistling type noise but it's only once the road speed increases. Hard acceleration at low speed doesn't cause the noise until about 40-50mph. Above that, it happens when throttle is applied. The noise doesn't change in tone with revs / road speed. Sitting in neutral on the drive and giving the throttle a good push doesn't cause the noise but maybe that's because there is no load on the engine.

I'm chasing my indie to get them to have a look at the missing bracket issue. I fear a body off in which case I might suggest the manifolds are changed. Actually, just quickly looking for prices of these, RimmerBros have them at £600 each +VAT! F**king Eek! That's looking like a £2.5k+ bill to replace them both... Censored 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #510149 Tue Nov 15 2016 11:03pm
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Disco_Mikey



Member Since: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Posts: 4393

United Kingdom 2010 Range Rover Sport Supercharged HSE Santorini Black

I have succefully had manifolds skimmed in the past Thumbs Up

Most annoyingly, the TDV8 FFRR manifolds are only £60 each Rolling Eyes Evil or Very Mad

Post #510155 Wed Nov 16 2016 6:41am
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Paddi



Member Since: 06 Jul 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 1563

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Java Black

RRSTDV8 wrote:
Mine has started making a whining/whistling type noise but it's only once the road speed increases. Hard acceleration at low speed doesn't cause the noise until about 40-50mph. Above that, it happens when throttle is applied. The noise doesn't change in tone with revs / road speed. Sitting in neutral on the drive and giving the throttle a good push doesn't cause the noise but maybe that's because there is no load on the engine.


Not quite the same symptoms as mine then. I only have a whistling and it comes in at 2000 RPM. At higher revs it is not apparent although could be masked by the greater engine noise. Don't hear it revving up in neutral.

From the workshop manual:

The cast iron exhaust manifolds are unique for each cylinder bank. They are sealed to the cylinder head by means of a steel
gasket. Sacrificial plastic sleeves are used to align the manifolds. These sleeves must be changed when refitting the manifolds.
Spacers on the securing bolts allow the manifolds to expand and retract with changes of temperature while maintaining the
clamping loads
.

Information kindly supplied by Dan at Duckworths:

"The exhaust manifolds are available and cost would be £566.00 inc vat,
£12.00 in studs and nuts
£15.00 gasket"


My independent say they have had manifolds skimmed too. So that sounds like a good option.

Disco-Mikey wrote:
Most annoyingly, the TDV8 FFRR manifolds are only £60 each Rolling Eyes Evil or Very Mad


Yes that is the worst example of JLR's predatory pricing I've ever seen. Disgusting. 2008 MY Java Black TDV8 HSE

Post #510160 Wed Nov 16 2016 10:43am
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Paddi



Member Since: 06 Jul 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 1563

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Java Black

Dropped in at the workshop today to see how things were going and was presented with this:

Click image to enlarge


Click image to enlarge


Bit of a shock first time you see your car like that Big Cry

Good news followed though as it seems the whistle was caused by a leak from the left turbo lower boost pipe and not the exhaust manifold as feared.

This is the problem, the boost pipe should have a jubilee clip at each end but the forward one was not attached (arrowed) and just swingin' in the breeze. There are no witness marks where it should be (red oval) so perhaps it was never installed properly at the factory or a careless fitter has forgotten to tighten it after some previous attention to the turbo Rolling Eyes
Presumably the pipe was tight enough to seal for a while but has softened with age and now allowing air to pass under pressure. That fits with the symptoms.
(and yes before someone says it - perhaps the guys should have blocked off the exposed upper orifice in case something falls in there)
Click image to enlarge


The bolt that the guys had noticed to be not fully home was one of the three securing the exhaust downpipe to the left turbo. It was cross threaded, probably because the flange was misaligned. Just a guess but I'd say a trainee inserted and tightened up the bolts one at a time instead of putting all three in finger tight and then torqueing up in sequence (schoolboy error). New bolts, running a tap through the threads in the turbo and a new gasket should sort that out.
Note - picture shows flange with crossed bolt now removed.

Click image to enlarge


Whilst the body is off the rusty rear brake pipes will be replaced, the crappy leaky metal sump on the gearbox will be replaced with a plastic OE version and new top boost hoses installed then she should be good to go in a day or so.

Won't be cheap but I was braced for two new turbos and an exhaust manifold so could have been worse. Fingers crossed. 2008 MY Java Black TDV8 HSE

Post #511074 Tue Nov 29 2016 5:22pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 12 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 8971

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

A (relatively) good outcome by the sounds of it. Hopefully it will result in a long and quiet life for the turbos from now on. Thumbs Up 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #511104 Tue Nov 29 2016 8:29pm
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Paddi



Member Since: 06 Jul 2012
Location: Hertfordshire
Posts: 1563

United Kingdom 2008 Range Rover Sport TDV8 HSE Java Black

Pleased to report she's back. Ran sweetly on the 12 mile trip home from the workshop. Considering all the work involved to fix the lower boost pipe assembly, sort out the dodgy downpipe connection, replace the four front to rear brake pipes, replace the upper boost pipes and finally rid me of the useless POS metal sump on the gearbox a very fair price.

Just in case you missed that....... the metal sump conversion is a complete waste of time and I recommend you never do it as the useless thing will leak like a sieve.

So nice to plant the right foot now and not hear the sound of air leaking past on the induction side. May be my imagination but it feels a bit more sprightly on the pick up.

It is good to take the car to a place where they appreciate it if you understand what's involved and give them credit for doing a good job even if they do gently rib you for being a bit fussy. "We didn't think you'd want us to wash it". (Correct!) 2008 MY Java Black TDV8 HSE

Post #511319 Thu Dec 01 2016 8:54pm
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RRSTDV8



Member Since: 12 Aug 2011
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 8971

United Kingdom 2012 Range Rover Sport SDV6 HSE Orkney Grey

Quote:
Just in case you missed that....... the metal sump conversion is a complete waste of time and I recommend you never do it as the useless thing will leak like a sieve.

Interesting. Mine has the metal sump following a recon by Bristol Transmissions. Not aware of it leaking. Perhaps I should drop the lower cover and check... 2012 SDV6 - it's missing a couple of cylinders
2008 TDV8 - it was a labour of love and is much missed

Post #511338 Fri Dec 02 2016 12:42am
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