Hmmmm i would not take too much notice of look at what this can do days an experienced driver can make each vehicle do just as they want with the launch of the disco 1 a LR driver tried to climb a slope concrete steps on the left dirt on the right in low box which to the inexperienced driver would seem the right choice it stopped once all four wheels were on steps- mud it then reversed down selected a higher gear floored it and was up .showmanship. i have been involved in building 4x4 courses and they are built to suit the maufactures vehicle as for vince cobley making a remark like that he should know better the differance a few psi can make could save your life a tourist in austrlia got his rented 4x4 stuck in the sand he and his wife perished when the vehicle was found the police reduced the tyre pressure and drove it out!!!! tyres are the most important piece without them you go nowhere yes terrain response etc is good but dont rely great for the inexperianced driver but it wont teach you how to read the lay of the land for the experienced an added bonus

Just my point most don't even understand how the car works. Unless you want to be deaf by the time you're 40 running tyres such as the coopers in the pictures are not really an issue, a few of the D3 guys use these or the G4 19" tyres. The car is so capable in its standard form most are not going to go beyond that.

The challenge was not any organised day BTW it was just BN putting a few people to shame at Tixover. I can assure you that at pay and play sites when you turn up in a shiny motor with no goodies on they expect you to fail, in my experience the car does not. I don't recall having mentioned tyre pressures or the like or driving in inhospitable parts of the world where of course you would normally travel in convoy and I wasn't aware that a grass field had such dangerous consequences

I fully agree with you also that reading the land is probably the most important part be it on foot, by horse or by car and for what it is worth I reckon that the LRE guys give an excellent grounding in this but you can't get too much training but looking round pay and play sites there are too many people who think that because they have the in tyre, winch and a snorkel they are unstoppable, where as with some training and understanding they could achieve more in a lesser car

. Even Vince Cobley at one of BNs off road days reckoned that the tyres play very little part in the cars ability, though of course it is sod's law that at some point you will need that little extra. sorry but a statment like that from someone who is an expert seems way off the mark tyres play the biggest part in a cars ability they keep you on the road or off in this case it could be taken in the wrong way by some. tyres their condition pressure and suitability for the job are a must

Can I ask if you are actually using yours off road? I don't doubt you are extremley competent off road but are possibly missing the point of the car. Lots and lots of very good drivers have dismissed the possibility of it being the best off road performer LR have ever built, but it is just that. No tricks no bull just straight out of the packet good. The only place it isn't supreme is in the back of beyond and I don't mean Portsmouth, that is only due to the difficulty of repair. It will go where a mud tyred defender struggles on standard wranglers. The trouble is people do not believe that electronics can gain traction where there should not be any.

Although a complete novice in offroad experience I would just say that when I did my LRE day the instructor stated that the RRS was probably the best off road car ever made! (He would say that though) He also said the Freelander was a surprisingly good offroad car!

Just my 2 pennies worth! 2005 Zambezi TDV6 - Gone but not forgotten
2009 Alaska TDV8 - Gone and much missed.



WINNER - 2009 �Idler Of The Year� Award
Runner Up - 2009 �Just Doing What It�s Designed To Do� Award


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VA if you've driven them off road you'll know he isn't lying. If you're on BNs day you will have a ball and learn lots, when I went we had some really experienced guys who have travelled the world overland and they learnt lots about the way to drive a TR equipped car most of which is exactly the same as any other LR but sometimes you have to do things slightly differently. What's more you will learn how to do it properly from the beggining. We turned up at Tixover and were like the freak show, but we were doing all that they were doing but with ease, even NeilR in his 20" stormers. There is no way the car should go were it does but it will with ease and providing you follow their rules in complete saftey

Pelyma - will my diesel with standard 19inch wheels/tyres be ok for simple/intermediate offroading? Sorry for sounding stupid but I've made a habit of it over my lifetime!  2005 Zambezi TDV6 - Gone but not forgotten
2009 Alaska TDV8 - Gone and much missed.



WINNER - 2009 �Idler Of The Year� Award
Runner Up - 2009 �Just Doing What It�s Designed To Do� Award


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if you check out the image you will see a RR that gracefully slid down a small slope the tyres could not grip the electronics did not help it was lack off grip these drivers would have been experienced i have not knocked the capabilities of the RRS D3 ETC i am just try to state that with out grip you are up creak with no paddle you need it to move and to stop electronics CANNOT make tyres grip if no tyres have grip the elecs can do nothing the same as a manual vehicle its not rocket science as you stated after getting stuck going up a greasy slope the tyres spin eat thrugh the greasy surface onto something hard and the tyres that have grip take you on the challenge comes when there is nothing hard underneath then it comes down to tyre choice pressures etc[/img]just think you would not go rockclimbing in your best smooth bottomed leathers shoes now would you ( unless you have a death wish)

Yes I was there when it happened at the Waterloo Cup last year driven by Cheshire chief of Police. He was driving quite quickly and since when does a RR have TR? It is the properties of TR that I am proclaiming but no if you drive too fast then the consequences are bad - are you suggesting that a M&S tread would have saved him, I can tell you it would not. He was very embarressed though

I take it that you have not driven your RRS in any significant terrain then? As I have said before the TR programs gain grip where you would not believe it possible. Of course if there is no traction you have no control, but the electronics does find it and it is spooky.

IF I PUT IT IN CAPITALS MAYBE YOU WILL GET THE ONE SIMPLE POINT I HAVE TRIED TO MAKE FROM THE START IF YOUR TYRES DO NOT GET ANY GRIP YOU DO NOT MOVE OR STOP TRUE/FALSE SIMPLE I have not knocked or do not knock the capabilitys of a D3 or RRS is that simple enough the man in the pic told a slightly different story i was not there if not i will get some pictures and bigger letters :lol:did i say it had TR :AND NO I JUST SITS IN THE GARAGE

Last edited by noddy and bigears on Tue Jan 17 2006 10:33pm. Edited 1 time in total

Noddy & bigears, pelyma - I doubt you 2 will agree! I worry this might get a bit out of hand. Personally I always find catapilars tracks best! 2005 Zambezi TDV6 - Gone but not forgotten
2009 Alaska TDV8 - Gone and much missed.



WINNER - 2009 �Idler Of The Year� Award
Runner Up - 2009 �Just Doing What It�s Designed To Do� Award


DO NOT CLICK HERE!

Very annoyed wrote:

Noddy & bigears, pelyma - I doubt you 2 will agree! I worry this might get a bit out of hand. Personally I always find catapilars tracks best!

funny you should say that i have a little 1962 model bulldozer that is under restoration but thats another story but they have big probs when they go down

 2005 Zambezi TDV6 - Gone but not forgotten
2009 Alaska TDV8 - Gone and much missed.



WINNER - 2009 �Idler Of The Year� Award
Runner Up - 2009 �Just Doing What It�s Designed To Do� Award


DO NOT CLICK HERE!

LOL I think that's what they call reading terrain!

VA I'm not interested in falling out with anyone I'm sure Big Ears & Noddy is an adult like myself and isn't really getting hot under the collar. We seem to both perfectly agree that you need grip to provide traction, what my point is that having now driven a TR equipped car for a year regularly off road, even the standard tyres find grip that even more aggressive patterns don't seem to find on non TR equipped cars.

The picture of the RR looks like the one that went splat at the Waterloo cup, having nearly driven my friends RR off the track it was driving too fast for the conditions which is very easy on grass and the rest was history

You will be amazed when you do get to drive yours off road at BNs event, it will be the best extra you'll ever buy for the car. You will find out how not to embarrass yourself in a grass field, which is where I think this started. I was suppossed to be demonstrating to my best mate and his family how amazing TR is after only 2 days of ownership. It all came down to two things really DSC is very bad in lots of slippery situations as it backs the power off and secondly not to give up too quickly. My confidence was severley knocked in the car as I know my Freelander would have driven around the field no problem. Having now had training at LRE and at BNs day and driven it regularly off road since I now know what the car can do and why.

The way I see this is that tyres can and will make a big difference to any 4x4 vehicle but the RRS and Discovery 3 will go a lot further on road tyres than most 4x4's due to the terrain response system.

Also correct teaching will help us all because the way to drive these new vehicles off-road is totally different to how I was taught in a Discovery series 1