Well, I've been looking into Rovers for the last month for the first time ever. My wife and I are replacing her 2000 Dodge Durango and she wanted to go with something much nicer this time around. Based on a combination of overall size, cargo space, styling and drivability wants/needs, we orginally narrowed it down to the RR vs the Lexus GX470 (LX was too big). We had initially looked into the RRS as well, but preferred the RR for a vaiety of reasons.

We thought we had settled on the RR and then ran into a dealbreaker. The RR is just too high for my wife to easily get the kids in and out of car seats (See this thread over on another forum if you're interested in the details). So, we're back looking at the RRS.

I'm one of those folks who does lots of homework before they buy, so I've already looked into LR in general and previously done a comparison between the RR and RRS (I'm a geek so I made a spreadsheet ). My test drives of both have highlighted some differences between them. Additionally, I've spent lots of time looking at brochures, website info, reading forums like this one and even downloading the manuals. However, there are things that are difficult to judge unless you've spent more time with each so I'm interested to read what RRS owners think.

So RRS owners, what are some pros/cons in your opinion of the RRS vs the RR?

Thanks in advance.

Jeff

I have owned several RRs over the last 20years and was about to buy a Vogue 12 month old 2003 last year, but I found it too big, too slow and a little old man style even though I'm getting on a bit. You either needed to pimp it up a little and look stupid and retune the engine at masssive expense or wait and get the Range Rover Sport. Diesel is fine and the TurboChip appears safe and cheap...looks absolutely fab, personally I wouldn't bother with mods like huge chrome alloys and black out windows and supercharge badges because it looks tacky (to me) just standard as it comes.
I am very impressed with mine over the last 3 or 4 weeks since owning, very impressed.
If you do too much homework though, you won't get one at all because you'll find out they're unreliable and the dealer back-up isn't any good. Read some of the dealer feedback posts here.
For example if you need to lower the suspension for access height often then expect a new compressor to be fitted every so often,
Same applies to the powerfold mirrors.
Also faults showing with power steering, water leaks, build quality, lights, windscreen wipers, sound system, sat navs, etc...
welcome to Land Rover! tdv6se owner since end of sept 05

Thanks for the feedback. I did mull over the reliability issue for about a week after seeing lots of posts about problems even on 2005 and 2006 RRs. In the end we decided that while the GX was a "safe" choice from a reliability standpoint, it was also boring and plain. We know what we'd be getting into with a Rover, so there won't be a surprise if issues do come up. If problems did arise on the GX, however less likely, we'd be left with a boring car that wasn't even reliable.

The dealer I'd use for service is less than 10 minutes from my home and is owned by the same group as the dealer we'd buy from so no worries about loaners, etc. I also used to wrok with a guy who sold LRs for years. I talked to him before looking at them and he still knows all the managers for that dealership group. While neither of those has anything to do with whether the vehicle has a problem in the first place, I'm hoping it would lead to better service should I need it.

With any luck, we'll make a decision next week (of course, I was hoping we would have decided already).

Jeff

Guest wrote:

For example if you need to lower the suspension for access height often then expect a new compressor to be fitted every so often,
Same applies to the powerfold mirrors.
Also faults showing with power steering, water leaks, build quality, lights, windscreen wipers, sound system, sat navs, etc...
welcome to Land Rover!

I have no idea why RRUK is so rude.
I think most people on these boards understand and appreciate what Guest says here, that the RRS is very impressive but after doing some research don't expect it to be reliable.

No worries, I think RRUK is more upset and embarrassed over his posting in 'wheel upgrades' and he's just having a dig back. I've read many of his interesting posts and he's usually helpful.
I think most people know you can't have everything.
Build quality, then German
Reliabillity, then Jap
If you want a fantastic looking, great handling, best off-roader then get a Rangy Sport.
The fact RRUK and many others including myself haven't yet had any problems is great news but as I have had 20 years experience with Land Rover I'm sure I can rely on it being unreliable sooner or later. That's not a problem when you are expecting it but maybe for a newbie, ...Welcome to Land Rover Jeff.
I'd recomend anyone a Land Rover before a Jap or German 4 x 4 , and a Sport before the full size Range Rover, the more owners, the more chance of putting problems right with these excellent forums.

Apparantly the SC has a different make of air compressor. tdv6se owner since end of sept 05

I think the word that seems to have caused upset here is "unreliable" I don't really think any of the points that Guest made have made the car an "unreliable" one. An unreliable car is by definition one that you cannot rely on to perform the task that it's there to perform.

Sure, certain unfortunate owners may have had isolated issues with their cars which have required attention and it's good that these issues have come to the surface for the benefit of other owners. However it doesn't make the RRS (or any marque that might have had these accusations levelled at it) an unreliable car in general. The comment has been made on this forum by members that are also D3 members that it seems a lot of the teething problems suffered by D3 owners appear to have been cleared up for the release of the RRS.

As time passes and RRS ownership levels increase and hopefully as membership levels of this forum also increase, a truer picture of reliability across the user base will be able to be seen.

I'd tend to agree with RRUK's response, I don't think he's having a dig anymore that I'm not having a dig in this post. I agree with the reason behind RRUK's post in that I'd say it was unfair to suggest to a non-owner looking for a balanced viewpoint that the RRS is an unreliable car. I think it's too early in the car's life as a shipping product to be able to say either way. So far it seems there are no wide-reaching horror stories.

Just my opinion, of course... as with all others here  

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No worries about bluntness. I'm originally from NY so I don't mind it at all. Like I said, if we get an RRS, I know the reliability history with LR. The 2005 JD power numbers (see here and here) put Land Rover almost at the very bottom of all manufacturer vehicles surveyed. In comparison, Lexus is at the very top. I have also seen various posts by users (mostly RR) about repeated issues they have had. Over on those other forums, one user is even doing an informal survey for RR owners to see how many have had problems (see this link).

Now, the RRS is a new vehicle and it remains to be seen whether this one will have similar reliability issues as the RR or improve in that department. Either way, I accept the fact that I'm likely to have more problems with any LR than the Lexus. Still though, I prefer the RR/RRS as being a ton more stylish.

I think we'll be going by the dealership tommorrow morning to double check the height issue in the back seat. My wife also hasn't sat in the RRS, so I want her to check it to make sure she likes the feel. If all that goes well, I think we'll be ordering an RRS.

By the way, here's the configuration we're likely to get:

RRS Supercharged
Bonatti Grey/Ebony
RSE
Sirius Sat Radio
PTI
Side Steps
Rubber Mats

Possibly also:
Stormer Wheels
Lined Oak

Thanks again for all the feedback.

Jeff

Go for the looks - personally I wouldn't care if the RRS handled like a dog, IT LOOKS FANTASTIC!!!! 2005 Zambezi TDV6 - Gone but not forgotten
2009 Alaska TDV8 - Gone and much missed.



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By the way, part of what I was doing with my RR/RRS comparison was trying to find some of the less obvious differences between the 2. Here are a few:

- No option for Power-Tilt steering wheel
- Heated seats option but no heated steering wheel in the RRS
- Adaptive Cruise Control not available as option on RR
- No rear-view camera on RRS
- No tire pressure monitir in RRS, but low tire pressure warning indicator
- No rear climate control in RRS

Not sure on this one: is the spare full-size in the RRS?

Any others like this that I haven't mentioned?

Jeff

I too think it's a little unfair to tag the RRS as unreliable and that all LR products are so.

Don't confuse the full RR with the RRS, they shouldn't really be compared, especially price wise.

I've owned Defenders, Discos and now a RRS over a 12 year span. You can believe me or not but we have had NO issues in all the years we have owned them.

I've always been amazed at the things some people say about LR. I've dealt with three different dealerships and all have been helpful and professional.

In the case of the Forums, remember people only come on to complain, rarely to praise and it is NOT representative of the marque. There are many thousands out there who do not use the internet forums and own a RRS with no problems. It would be hard to put a ratio or percentage on it.

I am aware however that dealers in the US are not that good with the brand, could it be US brand patriotism underlying the dealers thoughts. I understood that most were multi franchise. Then again it could just be a distance from the factory issue.

I've probably put a hex on my own vehicle now, but so far in 6k miles I'm overall very happy with it.

Oh and by the way I don't see what was rude about the post.

rgbyhkr wrote:

By the way, part of what I was doing with my RR/RRS comparison was trying to find some of the less obvious differences between the 2.

Jeff, there are several differences like you mention. The RRS isn't really a baby RR at all, it's grown out of the D3 stable as I'm sure you know. I'm sure LR don't want there to be any crossover between the two either - they have their big RR market and are happy that there are people who will spend upwards of £70k on a Vogue with all the trimmings. The RRS appeals to a different market I think... probably younger, caring more about how their car looks, drives & performs with the practical aspects a little lower down the board. Personally, I think this is one of the great selling points of the RRS - it has the guts to appeal to a market that would normally buy BMWs, Mercs & Porsches but can ALSO do the practical stuff effortlessly. I think LR deserve a bunch of success for the concept around the RRS - it's a great car.

Sure, there are things about mine I wished were different but a lot of them are based on my previous experiences with other marques and I don't blame LR or the car for the fact they do things slightly differently. I grumble, but then I grumble about a lot of things

If you buy one, you'll know you made a good choice!

Cheers
Steve 

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Tasmod,

I agree that it's unfair to really compare the RR and RRS, especially since they are built on different platforms and priced in different segments. However, it is what it is. I don't fault the RRS for not having certain options. That goes hand in hand with the large price descrepancy. I didn't mention obvious differences like interior luxury, etc for that reason.

I was just trying to know what I can before taking the plunge. I think we've all made purchases before when we say later on something like "I thought it had X feature". Since I had spent a lot of time looking into the RR, it's easy to confuse what features are available in both models vs being exclusive to one or the other. It's especially easy to overlook since so many features are offered in both. If not for the height issue, we would have gone with the RR. So, I just want to make sure I know all the details about the RRS before deciding on it.

As for the reliability issue, I certainly don't think that every LR is problematic. And, yes, product specific forums are places where people usually come to report or complain about problems rather than say how great things are. However, those JD Power numbers seem to indicate the existence of a trend for LR vehicles when compared to other manufacturers. There would seem to be an much greater likelihood of problems with a LR than with a Lexus. Sure, you can get a LR with no problems, but it would appear that you are more likely to have problems with a LR. What matters is that I know this and am ok with it. If not, I would have eliminated an RR or RRS from consideration a couple of weeks ago.

Jeff

Can anybody join in? I’ve had two Defenders, the first one was exchanged after six months because of body problems with hinges becoming unstable and the back door nearly dropping off.

I’ve had RR over the years, from the very first one in the 70’s, with one again being exchanged (in the early 90’s) because of excessive rust, electrical problems and interior panels falling off.

But I still drive a RRS….not, because its build quality is world class, its not, but its certainly getting better. It’s more about the comfort, safety and the ease of use. All of which are totally subjective views. There are no correct opinions – but lots of different points of view.

My wife drives a Mercedes ML, she’s now on her 3rd. The first one was replaced after a fight with MB…the other two have been just fine, but if you want to see poor quality just have a look in that direction.

Ford is doing an excellent job with dragging LR into modern production methods. I’ve visited the factory a few times and it was almost farcical how bad the production line quality was implemented, it was all about numbers and getting the goods out, irrespective of how often they would have to be returned to the dealer.

I think that has changed dramatically, but they still have a long way to go and I have no doubt, they monitor these pages and report on forum members views.

So, Hi there big brother……!

Just so it doesn't get lost in the fray, I wanted to ask it again. Is the RRS spare full-size?

Jeff